Titsy's new daily - What to get?

[Titsy]

As a starting point the Focus was a 1.6 petrol with the following stats:

5 speed manual
98bhp
145 Nm torque
delivered 35mpg regularly but would give 40-45 on a run
0-60: 10.1
kerb weight 1077 kg
Road tax £170/year
Insurance group 11

It would be nice to get something more fuel efficient but I'm not if there are any limitations on weather to go for a diesel or not in terms of the number of miles I regularly do. My work journey is 10 miles door to door and I do average miles per year (10-12k). What's the deal with particulate filters on modern diesels?

I'm considering something with more load space (mid-size estate) as there have been a few occasions where it would be really useful, but not really on an every day basis so I'm not sure it's justified or not.

I don't really want to get reamed on insurance but I'm not going to bulk at an extra £50-£100 a year if I'm saving elsewhere on tax or fuel.

I had a salesman try and talk me into a 1.4 petrol Astra yesterday. It seamed sensible in terms of fuel economy savings, and made 100bhp with good fuel economy, but it was another 500kg heavier than the focus so took 3s more to 60. Now I might find I can live with this for a daily if I get the Camaro back on the road. But I can't help thinking I might miss that little extra. That said the focus may have lost that much over the years and I might not tell the difference.

I'm after something that's going to last me a good while, so probably not much more than 30k on the clock and a limit of 5 years old if it's a low miler.

In terms of budget, I really don't want to spend any more than 8k if I can help it.

Suggestions very welcomed...

[Titsy]

I test drove this yesterday:
http://www.mkcarstore.co.uk/used_car_detail.php?RegPlate=HK57FUP&occ=Milton%20Keynes
It was quite tide for a few minor blemishes on rims and the nose ( some of which they said they would sort), but drove fine and had a full history. Was showing +50mpg on the trip computer.

The boot was a good size for a mid-size estate:


Pulled well with 150bhp, but at insurance group 21 is going to cost another £150 till I can change company, and seeming then not much more.

WDYT?

Still not sure if my driving requirements would rule out a diesel or not...

[F Body]

Quoting: Titsy

WDYT?

After six years of Diesel went back to a petrol daily last year

Plus Points :

It's a lot quieter.

Much wider power band ( but less torque ).

Warms up 10 x quicker than a Diesel in the winter.

Cheaper to service & easier to repair.

No more mucking around with gloves when fueling.

Minus Points.

Road tax is higher ( for the time being )

Fuel consumption is 26.5mpg around town which hurts (47mpg on a run )

NB : Even at 26.5mpg it will still take me 62k miles to break even the extra cost of the Diesel version.

Astra Estate.

The Astra doesn't have a stella reputation in the surveys, but it's generally well built, if a little dull. The 150bhp engine is stonking but if you use it to the max it's gonna eat the front tyres and the estate is the only Vauxhall car made in the UK.

EDIT :

I can't beleive that you aren't go to join the MKB Mondeo Owners Club

[art b]

how about a golf estate..
or the seat equivalent,
 they seem well put together
and reliable... prob petrol if you dont go far..

[art b]

along these lines..

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/SEAT-IBIZA-1-4-SE-ESTATE-LUNA-GREY-/271153364587?pt=Automobiles_UK&hash=item3f21fffe6b

[Incursus]

I've been fortunate to drive a lot of different cars over the years and my favourite all round, value for money, daily hack has been without a doubt the Mondeo...
Almost German build quality combined with one the of the best diesel engines I've driven and cheap Ford parts..

Drove a brand new Focus estate a couple of days ago, it was fine to drive but the interior styling wasn't to my taste, nasty tbh and the road noise seemed excessive.

I've not driven an Astra for a long time, not since Fatima had one for company car, it was ok but had the most uncomfortable seats of any car I can remember driving.  
Other cars I can think of off the top of my head that I liked (should be in the price range I haven't checked)... Skoda Fabia or Octavia, Honda Accourd, Audi A3/A4, BMW 320D and of course the Mondeo.

Saying that I'm saving up for a Mercedes CLC220 after having a ride in Abu's never considered myself a Mercedes man before...must be getting old

[Roadkill]

Driven both this model and the last model Astra (parents car) - not impressed with either.  

Mondeo gets my vote.

And who wears gloves when refueling ! ?

[Titsy]

I think I'm sold on a 1.6 TDCi Focus... Does 60+ mpg, £30 tax per year and pulse ad well as my old focus. If I can find an estate I'd be made up...

[Fieldy]

Focus, Mondeo or Seat Leon.....

[art b]

id imagine there are thousands of ex fleet focus around,
 as with the mondy..it does bring the 2nd hand price down as a rule..

[Cunning Plan]

Although Diesels are more expensive to buy compared to Petrol, the price difference reduces if you are buying a second-hand vehicle. Couple that with daily MPG savings and that the car will always be worth slightly more if you decide to sell, because it is a Diesel, as a daily, you would be better-off with one.

[daveyboy]

try a chrysler 300 6.1 srt hemi tourer. driven sensibly it will maybe get you to work and back on a gallon or two, has loads of room in the back . insurance is crippling but if you get it off comapre the meerkat at least you will have a stuffed toy to hang in the back window.

seriously though with prices the way they are i would go for a vectra diesel estate. not as good to drive as a mondeo but just as reliable and you get more car/spec for your money.

then again dont listen to me, my daily for my 15 mile commute is an old 98 plate subaru outback 2.5 auto with 69k on the clock
it does 28mpg max, goes most places , brill in the snow, has never broken down in the four years ive own it and goes around corners like its on rails.
i paid 1700 quid for it four years ago when it had 34k on the clock and its passed its  mot first time all the time. still puts a smile on my face when i drive it

theres no expensive diesel pump or dual mass flywheel to go kaput either

[Andy]

Quoting: Titsy

I think I'm sold on a 1.6 TDCi Focus... Does 60+ mpg, £30 tax per year and pulse ad well as my old focus. If I can find an estate I'd be made up...

What year?

There are a lot of people on the Ford Owners Club who have diesel Foci and there are two different types of DPF filters that they fitted depending on the year.

[Titsy]

I think I have a contender. A 59 plate 1.6TDCi 110 DPF Zetec hatch with 30k on the clock FSH. It's a bit more than I wanted to pay, but I've had to adjust my expectations on mileage to price ratio...

Quoting: Andy

What year?

There are a lot of people on the Ford Owners Club who have diesel Foci and there are two different types of DPF filters that they fitted depending on the year.

Anything I should be wary of?

The test drive I did was reasonably similar to my drive to work, (but with some bigger hills) and returned 50mpg. I figure based on my average mpg I've been used to and driving around 12k a year I should save £550 a year on fuel. The tax is only £30 a year compared to £170 on the old one. The guy was going to put £12 months on and I'd only just put 12 months on the old one so I should get 11 months back on that. The inside and outside are really tidy. There was a mark on one door handle, but he polished that off there and then as it was something on the paint rather than a scratch.

[Andy]

Ok, the Mk2.5 (08-11) has three options I think for a diesel engine. Has the 1.6 litre TDCi, the 1.8 and I think a 2.0. The 1.6 Litre however isn't a Ford or Duratec unit, its actually a Peugot unit. Its quite notorious for blowing and munching turbos. Something about the oil lines getting cooked, anyway, they come up a lot on ebay and that with needing turbos replaced. That said, if the service history has been kept up to date they should be ok.

I think since the 07 plate they started using the DPF in the exhaust system, early ones used a different type to the later DPFs that require the fluid to be topped up.

Not too many horror stories on the DPF front as long as you occasionally give it a good thrashing to burn off the filter. I must admit I don't know the full ins and outs, but the service for the fluid to top up (which has to be done) is about £300-400 apparently.

If you were looking at a modern focus like mine, I can't recommend the 1.8 petrol enough. I must admit I'm disappointed with the fuel economy at the moment, averaging about 30mpg. But, some big pluses, its a Yamaha unit, it has cam chains, quiet and really refined. And I know its not your big yank lump with a bellowing V8 but it does make me smile when you get around the 4k region.

[Titsy]

Thanks for the heads up on DPF and turbo munching. I must admit that I shuddered when you said it was a pug engine.

I've done some research an now know what the consequences are. But apparently it's quite a popular and reliable engine from what I can see.

Turbo munching is like you say all down to maintenance. So so long as I keep up regular servicing it shouldn't be an issue. The problems tend to come when the oil isn't swapped out regularly enough resulting in blockages, but that will happen on any turbo engine...

The DPF is a concern, but I understand the fluid thing now. If the car is being used on short journeys then the exhaust temp doesn't get high enough for the DPF to work effectively and so it starts to clog. To counter this there is a fluid that is injected into the fuel to increase the burn temperature and so clear out the filter. It's this fluid that can need topping up at a cost of around £200 from a dealer. This used to be require replenishing more often in the pre 08 cars as the regeneration system wasn't as good at working out when this needed doing. The DPF and regeneration system on the 08+ cars is much improved and so long as the car gets a decent run the regeneration fluid lasts longer and the filter itself is spec'ed to last for around 100k to 120k miles. it's a £1000 job when it does go, but if I'm saving £600 a year running cost it all still works out favourably.

I'm still not sure about diesels, I know there are obvious day to day advantages, but when things go wrong it gets expensive...

[Cunning Plan]

.

[Titsy]

Quoting: Cunning Plan

.

[Andy]

Honestly though, at the mileage you're stating, I *think* when i did the maths, I worked out cheaper going for the petrol option. Especially when the price was circa £2-3k more than the equivalent petrol. I also, must say, had had enough of diesels. Cold starting issues, modern diesels being FAR more complicated and expensive when they go wrong. Ok a modern petrol still has millions of bits that can go wrong but the forums are smart and diagnostics on them are easier. Plus having seen my friend pick up a whopper of a bill for a DMF + clutch + starter, the idea puts me off.

Sorry, I'm firmly in the, either 1.8 or larger derv or petrol when it comes to focus.

One thing I can say though, the fastest ones are made in Vision blue

[Andy]

Just to add...

This may be of interest to you and any other Ford owners. I impressed the dealer when I quoted Etis to him when I was checking out the spec on my car.

http://www.etis.ford.com/

If you know the VIN (dealers can access it with just the reg) you can plug it in and get the complete build spec of the car, as well as all the options fitted and non-fitted.

Things to look out for on the Focus front would be the Climate package. They greatly improved the heated screens so gone are the days of stripey demists, and the engines (petrol) will go from stone cold to 90 degrees in about 5 minutes. This morning I started mine up, then set about clearing the snow and in that time it was hotter than the sun on the inside.

Also look out for the bluetooth and voice module. Trust me, you'll love it. Hilarity will ensue trying to get that mofo to understand phone numbers.

[Titsy]

Primary Features
Build Date:     16.07.2009
Vehicle Line:     Focus 2008-
Body Style:     5 Door Saloon
Version:     Series 32
Engine:     1.6L Duratorq TDCi (110PS) - DV6
Transmission:     5-Speed Manual Trans - MTX75
Drive:     RHD FWD
Emission:     Stage V Emissions
Air Conditioning:     Manual Air Conditioning
Territory:     (+)"GB"
Paint:     Ocean Blue (Metallic)
Interior Fabric:     Tic Toc / Mono

Minor Features
 Less Underfloor Stowage No.2
 Saarlouis Plant Built
 Security Lock Group No.4
 Less Special Equipment Package
 With Convenience Group
 Less SVO Application/Label
 'Zetec'
 Less Tyre Repair Service Kit
 Less Global/Auto Closing
 Power Front Windows One Touch Down
 With Manual Rear Windows
 With Privacy Glass
 Less Windshield Heat Shielding
 With Heated Windscreen
 Less Console Ashtray
 Less Temp Controlled Glove Box
 With Mini Overhead Console
 With Short Floor Console
 Int Env Colour - Medium Dark Flint
 Interior Feature Colour - Ebony
 Less Front Floor Mats
 Less Sun Blinds
 With Illuminated Sunvisor - Drivers
 With Illuminated Sunvisor-Passenger
 With Load Floor Carpet
 Roof Storage-Driver Sunglasses
 Less Roof Rack
 With Rear Spoiler
 With Dipping Rear View Mirror
 Dual Power Htd Signal Mirrors
 Less Special Front Seat Covers
 Less Special Rear Seat Covers
 With Rear Center Head Restraint
 With Drivers Manual Lumbar Support
 Less Passenger Seat Lumbar Support
 Less Temp Control Driver Seat
 Less Temp Control Passengers Seat
 With Driver 4 Way Mnl.Seat Adjuster
 With Pass 2 Way Manual Seat Adjust
 Less Trailer Coupling
 Ignition Flip Key With Remote Unit
 With Second Remote Ign Flip Key
 With Door Dead Locks
 With Door Entry Remote Control Unit
 Less Keyless Entry System
 With Variable Intermittent Windscreen Wiper
 With Heated Washer Jet
 Less Headlamp Washer/Wiper
 Less Sun Roof
 Air Crtn Rstrnt LH
 With Driver Air Bag
 With Passenger Air Bag
 With Side Air Bag - Drivers Side
 With Side Air Bag - Passenger Side
 Less Isofix Hard Point Attach
 With Mini Steel Spare Wheel
 With Standard Rear Shock Absorbers
 17" Alloy Wheel Style 1
 205/50R 17 89W BSW Tyres
 Locking Wheel Nuts
 With Handling Suspension
 With Rear Drum Brakes
 With Brake Emergency Assist
 With IVD/Traction Control/ABS
 Less Skid Plates
 Sports Front Seat
 With Fixed Foot Pedals
 Steering Wheel - 3 Spoke Leather
 Less Speed Control
 With Supplemental Air Heater
 Conventional Instruments - Level 3
 With Trip Computer
 Less Tyre Inflation Monitor
 Navigation Data - Country Specific
 With Perimeter Anti-Theft
 Less Rear Parking Aid
 Standard Duty Battery
 Less Auxiliary Compact Disc Player
 BT/VC Phone Interface + USB Connect
 Low Level With Nav/CD/AM/FM Radio
 With 6 Speakers
 Voice Activated Module - British
 With Column Stalk Radio Controls
 Less Power Point Plug
 With Auto Headlamps
 With Halogen Headlamp
 Less Daytime Running Lamps
 With Front Fog Lamps
 With Black Headlamp Bezels
 Less Footwell Lights
 Header Mounted Courtesy/Maplights
 With Rear Overhead Courtesy Lamp
 Tail lamps - Level 1
 Less Headlamp Control

[Andy]

Quoting: Titsy

BT/VC Phone Interface + USB Connect

This is the other module, meaning it has bluetooth interface. Double check the modules are fitted by looking for a 'Voice' button on the steering wheel control.

It the Voice module not only dials saved numbers from the system, it also does basic commands with the stereo, such as playing a CD, changing modes (CD, Aux or Radio) and tuning radio stations either by frequency or by name.

It can also do Voice command on the iPhone, if you have one.

[Cunning Plan]

Quoting: Titsy

Sorry, I typed out a reply with some links to Autotrader cars, but realised it had my postcode on there, so went to change the links, but lost the text.

[F Body]

Quoting: Andy

Honestly though, at the mileage you're stating, when i did the maths, I worked out cheaper going for the petrol option. Especially when the price was circa £3-4k more than the equivalent petrol. I also, must say, had had enough of diesels. Cold starting issues, modern diesels being FAR more complicated and expensive when they go wrong.

[Andy]

Wooh! Got a plus one from the oracle!